I like how he uses his degree in film as a reason he understands budget issues. I know it could be a legitimate field of study but it seems contrived and unrelated to socialism, Proposition 8, The CTA, and the proper level of pay for teachers.

I use Netflix. Maybe I am an expert in film!

Mr. Lebeck,

Should teachers ever be required to get a CLAD certificate? Is it fair to make schedules that benefit them and limit other teachers because they lack proper credentials to teach some students?

The situation regarding the un-Clad is an instructive example of liberal do-gooders run amuck. The CLAD certificate has been in existence since the late 1980's but has only been required for teachers ENTERING the profession since 2005. The California Commission on Teacher Credentialing has put veteran teachers and the school districts they work for in a classic Catch-22 conundrum. While the CCTC honors the Lifetime Credential of the un-CLAD it also stipulates that no one without a CLAD certificate can teach in a classroom where an English Language Learner was present or could be present in the class. It's a mandate that could only make Pontius Pilate proud. The CCTC washed it's hands of any mechanism of enforcement of the mandate because it knew it would be breaking contract with professionals who had fulfilled the contractual duties of the same credential bestowed upon them by the CCTC. Rather than simply grandfather the mandate as they logically should have, they put local school districts in an untenable and ridiculous situation where 20 to 30 year veteran teachers were informed that they no longer had the "right stuff" even while deemed highly qualified under the auspices of NCLB and in good stead with the State of California.

Aside from the practical aspect that the CLAD certificate itself isn't worth much more than the ink used to stamp it, the law itself does not indicate a deadline for compliance and neither are there any sanctions or fines for school districts who have too many teachers out of compliance. It's all show and no dough.

Now to answer your question. Is it fair? No. However, to imply that individual teachers are somehow selfish or morally defective by not spending scores of hours of time and hundreds if not thousands of dollars to comply with a bureaucratic mandate that has little if any effect on making a difference in the classroom is an affront and a slap in the face of the individuals who have given 30 years of blood, sweat and tears. These teachers are not barring anyone from their classroom door. To make them out to be old and in the way or callous and insensitive to the needs of foriegn-born students is a lie. It is the State of California that is making it difficult for teachers and school districts to comply with this mandate. It is unreasonable, capricious and arbitrary. Let these folks retire with the dignity and the grace they have earned. They do not and did not deserve to be attacked and maligned by bloodthirsty jackals masquerading as colleagues, bean counters, and union representatives.

Shame on the State of California and shame on the SEA and the CTA for not standing up for these individuals holding a Lifetime Credential.

If it is a waste why didn't all the more experienced teachers stop it when it came up and why didn't they stop it from being a requirement on new teachers? Seems like because it didn't impact them they didn't care and allowed a mandate on newer teachers.

Shame on the more experienced members for saying a CLAD isn't valuable but standing by as it was forced on newer teachers. How come they didn't protect them from spending money?

The law is the law on ELD students being in a CLAD classroom. Should teachers that have had more than a decade get the first pick of schedules and classes just because they haven't done anything to get a CLAD and many of them allowed the mandate to be forced on others?

The first issue should have been stopping CLAD from being a mandate on newer teachers but because the other teachers refused to act it is now impacting them. No surprise there!

Seems to me, little nose-picker, you just want to pick a fight.

The point is, someone should be sticking up for teachers, the old as well as the new. The system, like mother nature, always preys upon the most vulnerable. First, they attacked the old, now they are preying upon the young and the least senior. What else is new in the animal kingdom?

You would do well to honor your elders and to save your hatchet attacks for the leadership, or lack thereof, that got us here in the first place.

I agree. Work to overturn the mandate. Your bitterness only serves to play into the hands of those that would seek to divide and conquer.

Who are you little nose-picker? Do you have a name or just a bag of bitter bile?

Seems to me that Magnus simply expressed an opinion on an important topic, and you responded by calling him a "nose-picker" and "bag of bitter bile". I thought these forums were for the free expression of ideas, something that an education professional should appreciate. Why do you have such a problem with individuals thinking for themselves?

Magnus expressed his or her opinion. I freely expressed mine.

My personal policy is that those who blog without a name are not entitled to the same deference as those who are willing to stand and speak as an authentic individual.

Bubba, since when have you become politically correct?

Far too many "pink slipped" teachers are looking for a scapegoat in this sordid matter. Out of understandable desperation on the part of many individuals, there is a pervasive sense of entitlement and growing resentment among many of the younger teachers in the district that is misplaced and rather ugly and narcissistic.

If they are upset with the current situation, I would encourage everyone affected or sympathetic to organize and get vocal. However, calling for the firing of the 80 to 90 teachers in the SVUSD who had not obtained their CLAD certificate is misplaced anger and I have little patience for for those who would rather tear the system down for their own benefit rather than work to reform a system that is clearly disfunctional.

In my own quiet way, I am working to try and save the jobs of all teachers who have been threatened with job losses in this current economic meltdown. Whiners and bomb throwers like Magnus and those who take glee in the misfortune of others, such as yourself, will always receive the full measure of my politically incorrect statements.

Why is that you think that I "take glee in the misfortune of others"? I happen to think that our misfortune, which by the way includes almost everybody in this economy, is in many ways self inflicted. With better fiscal management I believe that these types of situations can be avoided or less severe. I've never said that I enjoy watching teachers get pink slips, in fact I've gone on record saying quite the opposite. But we also have to recognize that we have put ourselves into a situation where there are no easy answers or shortcut solutions. And if some amount of pain is unavoidable then we have to be willing to make those tough decisions so that we can get through it as best as possible. And a crisis also gives us an opportunity to question our assumptions and make long needed reforms.

I fully support the right of any blogger, anonymous or otherwise, to express their opinions. That, after all, is what makes blogging such a powerful forum for the expression of ideas. I can certainly appreciate your particular point of view. At the same time, I think that you can express your disagreement with Magnum without the use of derogatory insults, since that goes well beyond just the expression of an opinion.

Teachers who have been pink slipped are very concerned about their jobs, which is certainly understandable. They are also members of the same collective bargaining union, and as equal members should have an equal opportunity to express their views, even if it may be a minority position. Educational professionals, of all people, should welcome the free exchange if ideas, even if those ideas may at times conflict with long held majority beliefs. There is no question that the current system favors long term employees over more recent hires, which is all the more reason why younger teachers should be allowed a voice, especially since they are the ones who will be expected to make the greatest sacrifices if sacrifices are to be made.

While I'm not really one to have gone through the state or local budget line by line, I do want to point out an interesting article, entitled, "Scrap the Sacrosanct Salary Schedule" on teacher pay, I thought worth sharing.

Like most states, seniority rules dictate pay. The longer years of service the higher up the pay scale you go and so on and so forth. The article notes that improved test scores have no correlation to the seniority of a teacher.

Perhaps the most interesting part for me. Doctors and Lawyers (Professionals) generally "reap the full rewards of competence in their profession within ten years of entrance. Teachers must wait 3 times that long, even though evidence suggests evidence suggests they [Teachers] become fully competent in their profession just as quickly."

I guess I'm at a bit of a loss as to why our public education system is "pink-slipping" less expensive, but just as effective teachers who just haven't been in the system as long.

Can someone explain this to me?

Scott,

I guess it's done for pretty much the same reason as police & deputies, firefighters, nurses, civil servants and a host of other professions do: so that workers who have invested a great deal in their careers can't be arbitrarily fired by some angry administrator. Especially when that administrator is voted in to or appointed to the position due to political whim.

And, as you suggest, it would be very easy to destroy the efforts of long time career professional if those administrators had the option of cutting jobs solely on the basis of who was being paid the most.

Mr. Lebeck,

I wasn't offended at what you said but the fact remains those that don't have a CLAD didn't organize or speak out much to stop it from being a requirement for others. Their silence added time and money for others to become teachers. They didn't look out for their profession. Of course those that complained the loudest that I know over their failure over the last decade to get a CLAD certificate didn't show up to support decent funding for schools. What a coincidence! Many didn't show up to stop CLAD from going through because it didn't impact them , or so they thought!

Now, the same teachers expect that others will look out for their insistence on never becoming fully certificated to teach all students? If we learn from this teachers should work together to simplify the credential process and take out requirements that have a consensus don't help students.

Just give us a timeline. How long should they be able to keep advantages in scheduling classes because they aren't funny certificated? They have had more than a decade. You want two decades?

This lifetime credential stuff isn't in the best interests of students, parents, or most teachers.

Many of them though are fine teachers and many of them did show up at the Pink Friday rally and support their fellow teachers. The rest of us should be able to argue over education without the name calling and negative comments.

I wasn't offended because I know when people don't have counter arguments they resort to name calling. Thanks for saying that I had a strong argument, even if you used other words. I have stood up for teachers for years.

Respect for elders? I think giving them jobs with no fear of losing them, preferred schedules not related to their skills, and more money isn't enough?

I have respect talented teachers regardless if they are younger or older. I also respect union leaders that try to explain or win us over, not ridicule our concerns.

In a budget meltdown I am supposed to tell some people they can do less, get paid more, and not have to worry for their jobs but I will help to organize so they don't have to take a test or a few classes?

Too bad they didn't feel the same way when it became a requirement to get a CLAD years ago.

Is it true they offered the classes either for a very low cost or free but many of the teachers that are complaining refused to go?

Rick,

Teachers with a Master's or PhD get extra pay for their degrees. As a compromise and an incentive open to all would you agree to pay teachers who have a CLAD certificate more?

I haven't thought this out much but it seems like a decent incentive to encourage more people to get more teachers in compliance.

Of course, the issue would be where to find any money to pay for for the plan.

Scott,

You bring up a good point. But it seems like it would cost the schools more money at a time when there isn't much flexibility in the budget. If they paid teachers more early in their careers it would seem to cause an overall increase in spending, even if the total pay to an employee stays the same.

But a correction to offer. The article might say there is no connection between experience and student achievement, but that isn't true. Teachers gain skills and knowledge that helps students over their career. While it might be true that diminishing returns kick in at a certain point and there is a marginal benefit to each added year in the years I have been in education and the majority of articles I have read teachers student achievement does increase as a teacher moves from the first year on. There is a difference between the first and second year of teaching although I would agree that gap isn't as large for each added year.

Mr. Lebeck,

I read over your comments again and I didn't address a serious point you made. I didn't call for the firing of those without CLAD certification.

I do think schools should be in compliance and that teachers should get CLAD certification, but I never said fire those that don't have it yet. A simple solution would be for them to become certified.

Brian:

Thanks for answering my question.

Dear Magn(animo)us,

Since you were not offended twice by my comments, I'll assume that perhaps you slightly were and offer a heartfelt apology. However, I do not apologize for my passion in protecting and defending good teachers when I perceive them to be receiving a raw deal. The RIF process is not the proper forum for separating the wheat from the chaff. Neither is it reasonable or just that a 30-year veteran be given the "death penalty" for failing to comply with CLAD requirements.

There needs to be better method for evaluating teacher performance and determining the effectiveness of their classroom instruction. But it is equally important that teachers receive a fair and impartial evaluation with respect to due process and their civil rights.

I, too, am disappointed, if not disgusted with the selfish attitudes at both extremes of the seniority list. But I want to assure you that whatever energies I can muster, I will endeavor to see that ALL teachers are protected from arcane and unjust practices. For the record, I do respect your concern but I do not respect your broadbrush villification of non-CLAD professionals as part of the problem. Be patient. Attrition alone will eventually solve a problem that has its roots in misplaced priorities and a lack of true leadership at both the local and state level.

Brian, as is his penchant, proposes a sane alternative to the bloodletting that passes as constrained civility in the turmoil over CLAD and the RIF process. Brian should be given credit for attempting to provide a forum for the many voices that are excluded from decisions that will have life altering ramifications for the many families of dedicated professionals who faithfully serve the interests of the community and other people's children.

Again, before the clock runs out on those being RIFfed, it is important that your voices are heard while you still have one. Remember that if younger, less senior teachers are let go before the District and the Union finally get down to real negotiations after the end of the school year, none of those who will be most affected will have any say in the ratification of any changes or modifications in new contract language that could open the door to their rehiring.

Let those who have ears hear what I am saying.

Rick,

The only real penalty was being forced to get a CLAD certificate. I don't understand all of the options but it included a test. What was the cost associated with the test?

Scott,

Did I really answer your question? I like the magazine from the website you linked to in the URL box. I looked for it last time I was at Border's but it wasn't there.

Thanks to all of you for reading and commenting on my blog.

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