Marie:

The problem with "city" art is that most of it is just so awful that it's a complete waste of citizens money.

So how are you doing?

Sheldon

Hey Sheldon,

I'm great! I'd be interested in hearing what pieces you like or dislike.

Marie,

I love Bus Home, to me it is the most visually interesting piece of public art we have in Ventura. Of course that's just my opinion, if you hate it, that's your opinion.

I feel the tragedy is the backdrop to the sculpture was supposed to be a new, modern, 2 story Pavilions supermarket. Not a semi-demolished, shabby, 40-year-old Thrifty drug store.
If Bus Home was in front of the new two-story Target with the bright neon Bullseyes, it would be more appropriate to the site. Also wasn't Bus Home more about the people interacting with the sculpture on the ground than about the people speeding by at 45 mph casting dispersions.

Maybe if it was a cute Thomas Kincaide lighthouse-bus-stop... then everyone would like it, except me, (darn still no unanimity).

But on a more positive note...
I like the new gates at the water plant, the front doors of the library, the canoe on the parking garage, the butterflies at the sports park, and the Paraflight sculpture at the Olivas Adobe.

I went to the city's website and looked at the collection so I could remember all the pieces. I'm not thrilled with the windmill or the umbrellas at the sportspark, but they're still far superior to the dolphins at the Santa Barbara Pier, or Rose shopping center. I don't like every type of music either, or every type of food.

The city sees the positive effect to its citizens by supporting culture, the positive impact to tourism, and the monetary benefit of creating an authentic cultural scene. The public art committee and cultural committee do fantastic things that enrich us all with a tiny fraction of money that apparently can't be spent on potholes and police anyway. The city can't try to please everyone, because it's impossible to achieve unanimity in art, music, food... I think we should be happy that out of the 50-plus public artworks, we don't have 50 dolphins, 50 Bus Homes, 50 Windmills, or 50 bronze soldiers on 50 bronze horses.

Or even 50 Eiffel Towers, because when that was built everyone hated that too.

Hey, I never said I hated Bus Home. I think it's kind of cool, actually, but it's not my favorite piece of Public Art, either. It's not lonely. When I went out to take that photo it was really busy out there.

One of my favorite pieces of public art in the county is the bronze grouping of figures at the Westlake Promenade. One is flying a kite; another is sitting on a bench reading, etc.

I don't like Thomas Kinkade at all. I want a Van Gogh bus stop. :-)

Ok, I agree that a Van Gogh bus stop would be cool... but i can't meet you in the middle with the kite/bench/etc.

You can love them, I can't. (You know those come from the "public-art-for-your-mall" catalog, don't you?) (We do have a child jumping over a turtle from that catalog in front of the Mervyn's mall.)

Hopefully, the City didn't have anything to do with the concrete toilet paper roll art (the new armor-plated bathrooms) that are in the San Buenaventura State Park. That was part of a $2 million boondogle where the citizens got nothing and the legless lizard and Globose dune beetle gained more habitat. Your tax dollars at work. I don't like the Bus Station either, but I do like the fact that local artists have been allowed to paint the utility boxes downtown and the trash recipticles in the Harbor. It didn't cost much and really adds something. I also like the mural at the entry of Marina Park. You can get a whole lot of art for what that bus station cost.

Art, it's a state park, so I think it was a state project.

OK d. shep, so you don't like the figures. I guess I look at a lot of things through a "mom" point of view. Those Westlake pieces succeed in my mind because they are really charming to children and families. My kids love them. I think "Making Lemonade" works in that manner, too.

My oldest loves the Parabolic Flight sculpture at the Olivas. My youngest loves the dolphins at the Esplanade because they blow steam out the top.

Let's face it ...without art life would be boring from the go get...people have been doing it publicly since the days of cave painting ...they were the earliest taggers...I like the majority of what the city has funded...and yes everything requires maintenance...but creating an environment of corporate looking stores, and dwellings...with boring landscapes that are easy to maintain is anything but stimulating to the mind
and soul...especially when we are surrounded with the natural beauty of our seasonally changing environment...what our city has done with the public art program for the size of our community has and will continue to put us on the map...we are creating an identity and decorating our environment...i love the variety in the corporate art collection....and am looking forward to the completion of Tortilla Flats Mural, the Museum Project with Paul Lindhard's Sculptures, and the Wave Project...as well as the Foundations Performing Arts Center...with all of that coming down the pike who would want to even consider screwing with the Public Arts Program...when are we going to paint the Train Trestle over the Freeway?....they have to anyways..and I've only been saying that for the past 20 years

For some odd reason, the city of Phoenix, while in another state, but just as close to us as San Francisco is, loves its public art program. Under similar guidelines as Ventura’s rules, a small percentage of the total cost of new real estate development must be used to create and place public art nearby. A highly touted book by some well-known, yet still obscure, art critic ranked has Phoenix as a 21st c. “public art city� in the same sentence with Berlin and Moscow. [http://www.mpacarts.org/phx21/index.php]. And without a doubt, Phoenicians are proud of their public art. # One might think that only a highly educated metropolitan area could, in general, appreciate public art--as an expression or symbol of their superior micro-culture. But Phoenix is neither uber-sophisticated, nor touting any superiority (other than they have the best dry heat in the country.) Yes, it is now the 10th largest region in America, but when ranked against other metropolitan regions for its citizens’ level of education, it’s down around 25th. Phoenix is not exactly a haven for the intellectual elite who tend to defend any and all public art. In fact, Phoenicians today are probably much like Angelenos were fifty years ago—a wild west town bursting at the seams but still living in the cultural shadow of big eastern cities. # I spent two years in Arizona as economic development director of the Downtown Phoenix Partnership before moving to California. While there, I noticed a trend in the way public art was both unveiled and where it was placed. First, the artist was often profiled in the press over and over again for his or her work that has been accepted and touted in their home city—NYC, SF, or DC, for example. They were edified and given immediate street cred. Second, the (memorable and popular) installations were usually created to make an ugly or banal setting, beautiful and interesting--a conversation piece that would cause people to say, in the case of a chain link fence cut into jagged shapes against the sky, “Wow, look at THAT freeway overpass. Look what they did. It looks like Camelback Mountain. Love it!� # I had this, and other comments like it, in mind as I sat on the jury to choose a sculpture that will be installed next month in downtown Ventura. With the Bus Home rumblings fresh in my mind, I asked myself a few basic practical questions about the viability of each of our 50+ choices: 1) is it vandal proof? If tagged will it be easy to clean or will it be ruined forever and just shame us? 2) Will it stand the test of time? Will it rust or will a patina over time increase its attractiveness? 3) And what kind of Wow! Factor does it have? # When you see what our most recent jury chose to place near the Promenade and the Crowne Plaza, I think most will think it’s not only appropriate but pretty darn cool. It’s vandal-proof, practical, and makes a statement about Ventura’s values. # As I see it, it’s up to the jurors who select the winning submission to also take into consideration how the piece will fly with the public--and to not operate in a vacuum. The selection should not be “art for arts sake�, but art that makes the space, within which it is placed, have more meaning for those that frequent that park, bus stop, or intersection everyday. Worthwhile public art satisfies the soul but should also have positive PR value, not negative. Ideally, it should make the overtaxed and weary taxpayer smile and mutter something like, “Wow, look what they put there. I’m glad my city gave this to me.�
~ Rob Edwards is the executive director of the Downtown Ventura Organization and attended the Graduate School of Fine Arts at the University of Pennsylvania.

PS: Our next order of business is to get CalTrans to repair, paint and up-light the dang train trestle over the 101 at California Street. That is a black eye on this city and downtown in particular. That trestle could be our historic downtown's calling card, but instead it's something we block out of our field of vision when driving under it. I say paint it metallic silver and light it with LED lights that can be programmed and changed frequently. Every major city that has undergone revitalization has paid close attention to their bridges. Why should we settle for CalTrans' neglect of this piece of infrastructure that could be considered PUBLIC ART?

I've been a cyclist and bus commuter since I came to California in 1991. Let me tell you, that bus stop is useless in the rain. That sculpture, which I love the looks of, has a lot of surface area that could have been sealed and used to create shelter. During this recent rainy season, I was commuting from Santa Paula to Ventura via Vista bus, and bike...and cursed that bus stop more than once.

Public art, on the other hand...personally I believe that well-placed, well thought out pieces of public art can do more for the well-being of community than a police or fire officer. Believe it or not. Fear factor lain aside...

I think it's a horrible thing that, recently, municipal money has been taken from libraries and parks to insure that every cop and fire fighter has a job. How about librarians? They need their jobs, too. Human capital is a tricky thing...and open space and reading are very important factors in the development of a healthy and productive citizenry. As opposed to a citizenry that is stuck on television, internet, and 911 calls.

Just thoughts....

Thanks Marie for another great thread. The public arts funding has long been controversial and misunderstood. I like the bus station but I don't like the fact that it doesn't protect the riders. I'm also not happy that it isn't being maintained. I think both issues can and should be rectified.

I would like to see the 2% be spent on local artists - I don't believe this is always done. I collect a lot of local art and I love hearing from people like Michele Chapin (not that I have one of her pieces yet).

P.S. I HATE Thomas Kincaide's work.

I was on the Public Art Commission for 8 years, and I voted for the Bus Home unanimously with the other 6 citizen volunteers that sitting on the Commission. The volunteer Design Review commission also voted unanimously at their meetings to approve the design of Bus Home, then the whole City Council came out to support it on opening day when it was shiny and new. The commission felt that one Modern work by a world renowned artist was a great addition to the predominantly local public artists we had already commissioned. Ventura has a national model public art program. My mother may not like Bus Home as much as I do, but people from all over the country come to Ventura to see how a public art program should work, and they all marvel at the diversity of our collection. Part of this probably comes from the fact that they spend the day on a tour of our 75 public art projects, and so they see the whole range.

To see the public art collection and municipal art collection online: http://www.cityofventura.net/depts/arts_culture/pub_art/pubart_projects_frames.asp

Or better yet contact the city at 805-658-4726 to get a map of all the public art sites, and make your own tour.
In Ventura the developers complain about the planning department, and the preservationists complain about the preservation program, and the community residents have view issues and sand issues, and the chamber has Walmart issues. However, our public art ordinance, commission and staff are a national model, and they don't need to be changed to make it better. Every new public art work like the Tortilla Flats Murals going on Figueroa Street will make the program more accessible, more diverse, and more successful. When we have 75 more public art works that the public loves (and a couple they don't all love), I hope we still have a debate over Bus Home, love it, or hate it. That means the other 90+ percent of the collection is embraced, and how often does city hall get anything 90+ percent right?

P.S.
I can't wait to see Bus Home shiny and new again with the 25+ year paint job it was supposed to have when I voted for it. Then the Public Art Commission and Transportation department can implement their plan to increase the rain screening above the benches.

Tim Schaffer? Photographer?

That was from Stephen Schafer, Katie. He's a well known -- and very talented -- local photographer. I am very pleased that he and Michele and Sophia posted (and you, too, d. shep!!) All very talented folks.

We have a wonderful, thriving arts community here and it is one reason why I love this town so much.

Everyone, note Chuck Thomas' column today in the Star. I sent him a couple of emails last week...

Stephen Schafer, photographer.
Tim Schiffer, executive director of the Museum of Ventura.
I'm the first one.

I meant Stephen - sorry! I've admired your photos of Ventura County and your calenders. I'm glad to hear your perspective.

I also know of Tim Schiffer at the Museum.

I think it is really important to look at our public art collection not through today’s eyes, but through the eyes of future generations of Venturans. What we are doing with all development here in the City is leaving an historic legacy for tomorrow’s population. Who amongst us isn’t thrilled that our County forefathers had the wisdom to choose famed architect AC Martin to design the building that now serves as City Hall? The tradition of architects and designers working with artists is age old. When I travel to cities around the country, I love to spend time exploring the cityscape, experiencing the evolution of a place as represented through its art and architecture. To view an eclectic mix of architectural and artistic styles existing side-by-side, complementing and contrasting with one another is much more visually stimulating than a landscape dominated by one single stylistic perspective.

In 1991 Ventura had the vision to adopt an ordinance that provides for 2% of eligible Capital Improvement Projects budgets be allocated for the inclusion of art. Much like FDR’s famed Works Projects Administration, we have an opportunity to incorporate an artist’s vision into our municipal facilities. In the late 90’s the City renovated two of our aging libraries and through two very different approaches, worked with artists and the community to tell a story about who we are. At the Avenue Library, Cathy Day’s interior mural, Portrait of a Neighborhood speaks to the history, culture and community that IS the westside of Ventura, truly the City’s birthplace. The library, located in a historic building, is home to an artwork that reflects the surrounding community’s history. In the case of the EP Foster Library downtown, Sally Weber’s entryway artwork Matrix is a composite graphic image inspired by the design of integrated circuits in computer chips. Woven within patterns in the glass are lines of poetry and quotations submitted by members of the public. This artwork speaks to today and the future as opposed to our past.

The key to a successful public artwork is to truly work with the public in the design process and then providing for an opportunity for the public to continue to engage with the work over time. Public art is about place-making. Creating something unique and valuable for the community. I would like to share a quote that I believe really hits the mark in defining what role public art serves in a community. Lake Douglas, the Former Director at the Arts Council of New Orleans said, “Public art is a mirror that reflects the local environment, cultural values, and artistic vitality of the community in which it exists. At its best, public art is more than just art installed in public places. It is a community-based process of dialogue, involvement, and participation. Public art enhances the quality of life for citizens by encouraging a heightened sense of place, enhancing a community’s prestige, and enlivening the visual quality of the built environment. Successful public art is site-specific and responds to the concept of place-making.� As a local citizen, I am proud that we as a City embrace and support the arts so strongly and passionately.

Ventura’s Cultural Ecosystem

When I think of what draws me to a place, what attracts me to it, what makes me want to spend time there; for me it comes down to the things that are unique to the location. This can be the geography; it can be the amenities, the things that are there, and the activities, among other things. What is interesting about a town or a city, and what draws me there are not the things that I can see in any town or city, what draws me in are the things that I can only experience, or can uniquely experience, in that town or city. I believe that Ventura has the components to make an incredibly unique city and destination. We have the beach. We have the mountains. We have a historic down town, with great restaurants and shops, not corporate or franchise. We have a cultural community, visual and performing arts, which are hard to rival.

There are many ideas, conflicting and otherwise on how to treat and manage each of these things, from the sand at the beach, to the access and development of our green space and mountains, to the preservation and development of historic structures down town, to the visual and performing arts programs. If we start to parse out individual things to target, and cut, if we are some how convinced that it is a choice between one thing or an other, that it is EATHER art OR sand management, then we loose. We fail to see the forest for the trees. All of these things are linked together. We as a community need to take care of each of these things. All of these components work together symbiotically to create our unique Ventura culture. Much like a food chain, or delicate ecosystem, if we start to remove one part of our culture, or chip away at one of the components, they all begin to suffer. If left to languish too long, the system fails, and breaks down, the culture dies. Ventura has come a long way to develop the culture we have, but we still, as is painfully obvious, have a long way to go.

I was fortunate enough to be in attendance recently at meeting of the Deans Leadership Council, for the California State University Channel Islands. In attendance were many community leaders from private and public institutions and governments. One of the attendees was Mayor Christy Weir. Each community leader or corporate representative gave a short synopsis of how things were going and how the future looked. As you might guess, with the current economic forecast, almost everyone including the University were bracing for large cuts in the budget, or drops in revenues. One bright spot, reported by our own Mayor Christy Weir, was data pointing to an increase in tourism domestically and from aboard. The price of gas and the weak dollar meant that Americans were not going to travel as far in the near future, and that many tourists form over seas were going to be coming to the U.S. taking advantage of the weak currency.

Ventura can be positioned to take advantage of these circumstances. We have all of the components to give our residence a unique place to live. The cultural programs that the city offers, public and performing arts, are one of the great things we have to be proud of. They are large and important links in our Cultural Ecosystem. We will NEVER agree on what IS or IS NOT a great work of Art; this is inherent in art itself. Conflict is inherent in any relationship; it can be the catalyst for growth, enlightenment, and education through discussion, debate and resolution. It is part of the responsibility of a cultural community to have these discussions, and to promote them.

From a purely economic standpoint, we have to give people, tourists, and travelers a reason to get off the 101 at California St., and spend some time, and some dime. Developing our culture is the way to do this. Otherwise, Santa Barbara and Los Angelus are only a few miles more either way. If we kill our culture, we are shooting ourselves in the foot.
Matt

My take on this is that most people don't know about the public art program and only really complain about the bus sculpture. If there are 50 works out there, I sure haven't seen them. They must be tucked away in spots I don't visit.

Marie, I went by Marina Park yesterday, that mosaic really is beautiful.

Why is it that everyone gets the most excited about the smallest part of the local budget? I think Ventura spends about 1% of its budget on the arts. I don't have a PhD in Economics, but that seems like a small investment yielding an excellent return. Let the investment mature a bit before it gets redirected towards some crisis du jour.

The City of Ventura should not be spending a single penny of taxpayers' money on public art when there are so many other vital needs in the community (i.e., public safety) and not enough money to pay for them. So much so, that the City imposes a backdoor tax on 911 calls to pay for more cops and firefighers.

City Manager Rick Cole brags that only $7,231 was paid from the City's General Fund for public art last year. Well, in my view, that's $7,231 too much. This is general tax dollars that should be going towards general services that benefit the public. Not all of the public likes or approves of the public art that the City sanctions or helps pays for, which distinguishes these expenditures greatly from those for public safety services, which everyone agrees we need.

Why doesn't the City do what Oxnard does and have private developers pay for all of their public art projects when they are building new projects (based on a percentage of the total square footage of each project). Look around Ventura, what you're doing is not always the best way to do things.

A private development fee for the arts is a stated goal of the city's Cultural Plan. If the development community were to support the fee, I would be all for it. They could either include a piece of art with the built environment or pay an in-lieu fee which would go into an arts fund.

This fee could also go to pay for cultural activities that generate revenue for the city.

Some developers here have agreed to a voluntary program to include public art with their projects. I really commend them. One in particular has really accomplished some remarkable things there.

Schaf, Larissa's work is remarkable (as is yours). I own some of her jewelry. I highly covet her larger pieces and hope one day to own one.

As an artist who has participated in public art, I strongly support the program. We are a diverse culture and need to remember, though, that you can't please all the people all of the time. Thank goodness we live in a free country and have an opportunity to freely express our ideas/opinions. Many public art works convey stories to the public about the community or maybe they twist reality in a way that makes us uncomfortable--there is fortunately more than one idea and everything isn't always orange! My personal goal as a public artist is to engage the public in my work and offer them an opportunity to think about my subject matter and maybe even learn something. Citizens of Ventura County 200 years from now will have some sense of what we were interested in by viewing our public art.
THANK YOU TO THE POWERS THAT BE FOR PUBLIC ART!

I'm glad mongo flamo isn't in charge. Art is a public value. As such, it deserves public funding.

Amen, Bob. Ventura would be a really scary place if Mongo was in charge. Wonder who with an axe to grind is behind that name, anyway?

How come that child jumping over a turtle at Mervyns isn't controversial? When was the last time you saw a child jumping over a turtle? How come I never hear complaints about that one? Because its representational? I think often people say they like what they can understand.

Find comfort in the discomfort. That is where learning takes place.

The only discomfort I see in the bus sculpture is by those folks who're getting all wet because theres no shelter there.

No axe to grind, Mr. Skippy, just an opinion that differs from yours. Something you obviously have a difficult time handling without going over the top. So sorry...

Hey d. shep, if you're still out there, I had some time today to look up the artist who did the fountain in Westlake that I like. She's done tons of public art projects including that bronze of Gene Autry and his horse at the Western Museum in L.A. It would appear developer Rick Caruso uses her works in nearly everything he does.

http://www.delesprie.com/spotlight.php/cat/2/id/5

Not my thing Marie, but Dennis Oppenhiem just installed a new sculpture in San Diego, let's see if they're progressive enough to embrace it.
see: http://weblog.signonsandiego.com/multimedia/utmedia/071130_publicproject/

Interesting! I can see why it's called Engagement. It looks like two big rings.

My name is Joseph Marraccino, the Sculptor Delesprie's agent. And Yes, Rick Caruso uses Delesprie for most all of his commercial open-air malls. Just an FYI. anartistmgt@gmail.com

Thanks, Joseph. My family enjoys her sculptures very much. Nice that you found this old thread and posted.